Sunday Morning Coming Down: Notes on UFC 84
(Photo courtesy of Sherdog.com)
Well, that was fun, no? A night full of surprises, a few knockouts, and the dreaded Ipecac bet ends in a tie, thus making it possible for Ben Goldstein's mother to rest easy, at least for now. Now that we've all had a chance to digest the evening's events and process the alcohol through our systems, let's see if we can't pull it together for a painfully sober look at what really happened last night.
- B.J. Penn dominates; Sean Sherk relies on worst game plan ever. I have to give it to Penn. He looked like a champion from start to finish, picking Sherk apart without getting too frantic and then showing his class after the fight was over. But at the same time, what was Sherk thinking? Standing and trading punches with Penn clearly wasn't working, as evidenced by Sherk's face after two rounds. He never seemed committed to getting the fight on the ground, and as a result only allowed Penn to grow more confident of his striking game as the minutes wore on. Maybe he hoped Penn would gas out after punching him in the face for fifteen minutes?
- Tito Ortiz's exit surprisingly graceful...until the press conference. It seemed strange that the UFC would even give Ortiz any time on the mic after his decision loss to Machida, but even more bizarre that he was mostly cordial about it. Then came the press conference, which Ortiz showed up at uninvited and caused a minor scene. Dave Meltzer describes an odd scene where Ortiz is asked to leave the press conference by UFC officials, but then told to stay put by Jenna Jameson. Guess who he listened to? What followed was a minor flare-up as Ortiz and Dana White accused one another of trying to be "superstars", an accusation neither is in a position to refute. Oh, Tito. You will be missed.
- Wanderlei Silva gets KO of the night, and a little breathing room. It might be too soon to say that "The Axe Murderer" is back, but he sure looked more like the Wanderlei of old as he put a quick end to Keith Jardine's night. Jardine just couldn't stand up to the power and pressure from Silva, who needed the victory more than anyone else on the fight card. If this is a sign that Silva is finally comfortable in the UFC and back on track, there are several interesting match-ups left for him in the 205-pound division.
- Reljic-Gouveia earn Fight of the Night honors, Palhares gets Submission of the Night. It was looking bad for Goran Reljic until a big left hand changed his fortune. I'm not going to call that a lucky punch, but neither am I prepared to call it the result of careful strategy and execution. Rousimar Palhares's performance, on the other hand, was impressive from start to finish. As for Salaverry, it might be time to find a new line of work.
- Shane Carwin is a monster. Seriously, lock your doors. Then go hide in the basement. Then, and only then, you can demand to see Carwin tested against a top heavyweight. But don't make that demand too loudly. He might hear you. If that happens just freeze. Like a T-Rex, his vision is movement-based.
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Comments
tony@rbd Says:
Wiping and licking the blood off of Sherk last night seemed like a dick move. However this morning it looked like a prudent choice. He left no doubts, as I could see by the Sherk fans immediately shuffling out of the Columbus Ohio BW3's. You could hear a pin drop during the fight, except when the Shark put together a combo that landed. Well done BJ.
fightfan Says:
I am glad to see that BJ had the fighters best interest in mind and "stopped" the fight. Everyone was clueless as to whether or not Sherk was out or the fight was over. But BJ took the initiative and said sherk was doen and gave himsel the TKO. LOL. That was hilarious. I know UFC refs have looked clueless MANY, MANY times before, but this eas a good one.
You got to wonder if it were anyone else and they quietly went back to their corner, would that fight of ended???? I mean, sure Sherk was rocked good, but the fight was not called and he was saved by the bell. In Silva/Franklin...if Silva would of acted like BJ, would that fight of been called also by the "fighter" . Franklin was in AT least, in the same condition, if not worse thasn Sherk's and he fought the next round......Not without help staggering back to his corner with help from corner guys.
I just didnt like how BJ influenced the calling of the fight. Mayeb Sherk just said I am done, But It looked like he could of been ready to go next round. Maybe he just realized the inevitable, but that was a funny ending when BJ took charge of the octagaon
cwr Says:
Even with BJ's influence over the stoppage I think that Sherk was done for. I may be making this up but didn't Sherk admit that he was not aware that the bell rang when asked by Rogan what he thought of the post-bell stoppage. Maybe I just misunderstood the whole exchange...
Anonymous Says:
wheres the videos?
Toner Breath Says:
GREAT UFC.
Penn knocked out Sherk, which is pretty apparent when you look at the replays. I don't really think he was trying to take over the ending of it, he was just kind of pointing out that he knocked Sherk the fuck out. If there was any question as to whether or not he was KOed, just watch Sherk's post fight interview, he didn't even know what happenned.
I'm surprised no one touched upon the Tito/Machida fight too much. VERY lackluster performance by Tito and great technical match for Machida. But Yves Lavigne stole the show! Did you guys catch the awesome tumble on his ass during round 2 or 3? I thought he kind of spiced up this fight nicely!
Hammer Says:
First off, I am extremely happy that BJ won and with the show he put on. That said, I think that it is bullshit "if" the fight was called on his influence, it has nothing to do with BJ though, he was just worked up into fight mode and happy to be whupping sherks ass. Its bullshit that the referee and whoever else may have allowed BJs actions to influence their decision.
Personally, I would not have called the fight provided Sherk could have stood up and walked to his corner. Yeah, he was out, but it looked like he recovered fairly quickly. But also, I really wanted to see BJ submit Sherk, heh.
Knife'um Says:
B.J. was right about sherk, he does'nt have it mentally, He was KTFO and was done,
look at his face. Sherk is a wrestler trying to stand up. He was flated footed, trying
swing for the fences, loading up on every shot, b.J. beat him down with his Jab, so you wrestler learn to move your f****N heads and learn the angles. Most fights went to the most elusive fighters anyway.
Russell Says:
If Sherk wanted to continue, he would have continued. He made no complaints about the stoppage so stop with this bullshit talk
MMA Fan Says:
Looked to me like BJ's reach advantage made a huge difference in the fight. There were so many punches thrown by Sherk that didn't connect because he was just a few inches too far away, while BJ was able to connect with his jabs from that same distance. Have no idea what Sherk was thinking with that strategy. You'd think after whiffing countless counter punches for a few rounds, he'd realize standing with BJ wasn't a smart approach.
And yes, Yves Lavigne falling for no reason whatsoever was the funniest thing I've seen in a long time! I've never seen that happen in mma or boxing. LOL!!!
Mondooh 3:17 Says:
Yves Lavignes face after his tumble was classic, he kept laughing at himself.. Wheres the video now
Anonymous Says:
Silva!! Yay!!! :)
im just so happy...
VEe! Says:
Whoa, wait a minute. BJ Penn won. That's about it. Period.
He called it, everybody agreed. It was funny, very funny.
^fightfan, Franklin-Silva II, The fight was over in the first round. Silva is just not that kind of guy. Franklin had no clue what happened in the 2nd round.
Tito's near submission of Machida was great! IF Wanderlei fought Machida, I'm sure he would have closed the gap at least once or twice. IS MACHIDA THAT STRONG IN THE CLINCH? He was moving Tito easily.
GREAT CARD!
JOE ROGAN Says:
MACHIDA IS VERY ELUSIVE. LYOTO ELUSIVE MACHIDA.
Jeff Says:
I felt so bad for Keith Jardine. I wanted Wandy to win but that was kinda scary.
Kim Couture is a cunt Says:
I loved seeing Sean Sherk get destroyed.
Hammer Says:
Actually I think that they need to change Machidas nick name from the dragon to "The Machine".
tipsyrockero Says:
Great card,
Sherk, what the fuck, he came into the fight to be BJ's punching bag and I loved it! Just stand there and eat his puches, lets see how long it is going to last, ohh just till the end of the 3rd round. He was KTFO. "What the bell rang? When and how long ago?"
Lyoto is a fucking tease fighter, no build up, no downs, no climax, fucker fight. "stop running i could still see you" I feel bad for tito. Not a fan of his but that was a horrible way for him to go out.
Silva, Lets see you do that to Chuck now. Yes Chuck vs Silve II!
for vids try mmalinker.com or dailymotion.com
Boneman Says:
I like Machida.....It shows you why they make "match-ups"...
Tito should of just stood against the fence and made Machida come to him. As much as like Machida, I can't stand when you have one very aggresive fighter and then one very raectionary fighter.....It was just a bad match-up as a "fans" point of view.
What about Lyoto "The Track Star" Machida ...??
VV Says:
That was a great fight card. Machida was very calm and threw a wicked knee. I liked that fight. The best part of the night was Silva showing he's back!. He's defiently been my favorite fighter for years now. Im happy to see him throwing down like that. I wonder if he thought about stomping on Jardine after punching him down like the good old pride days. Penn vs. Sherk was confusing, cuz Sherk was getting dominated and wouldnt change his game plan. I mean I know Penn's good on the ground too but he shouldve mixed it up a bit. Still happy Penn won. Never liked Sherk, even before the Steriod accusations.
soo Says:
if machida backs off and it's boring, what about when chuck does it? or when randy clinch and prays?
surprised sherk didn't go to the ground when the stand up was obviously getting him fucked over.
perkedel Says:
Is it just me or it looked like Joe Rogan was ready to give Goldberg a flying knee to the head?
D. Says:
Lyoto - The Sleepy Dragon - Machida. Very smart, technical fight - yes. Very boring and more frustrating to watch than to fight him - yes. Sure, I do not want to see dumb fights but this is, after all a form of entertainment and seeing him be elusive was not entertaining. Sure a solid gameplan is necessary when you are desperate to win - like in a back alley street fight but on PPV F_CKING FIGHT. People are paying you to put on a good show. I am f_cking paying you to fight. Otherwise, go into some basement and fight. No more Machida on PPV.
sol Says:
Machida's fight style capitalises on people making mistakes, for example late in the 3rd when he Tito square with that knee.
Thing is, Ortiz is no amateur, thats why the fight looked so slow, Ortiz wasnt stupid enough to shoot in until of course it was too late to do anything else.
Sherk didnt complain about the stoppage so neither should you.
L Grant Says:
What's with the man-crush on Carwin? He looked pretty impressive, and he's a really big dude. But, we've seen a lot of guys come out and look like this, Kongo, Kimbo, and, uh, can't think of another K or Cuh sounding name, but you get the point. Let's see him in a few more fights before you go and rub one out while watching his HL reel.
BIG CHRIS Says:
That ref falling down was funny butat the same time very sad, that makes me miss Big John McCarthy more than ever, the fights aren't the same without hearing...Are You Ready?!?! Lets GET IT ON!!!
Why Says:
is no one mentioning Kim?
Joe Rogan Says:
Look guys, I said that Machida was elusive at least 15 times during and after his fight. Therefore, his nickname will be "Elusive". If you disagree, then you're a bitch.
Dota Says:
Machida is boring not elusive. Elusive is Anderson Silvas head movement not backpeddling for 15 minutes.
Warcraft Says:
Machida is far from boring. Slow yes, but boring or backpeddling hardly.
He just resets alot and throws a ton of fakes it hard for oppoents to read and makes them switch up there game.
Machida controls the tempo of most fights and no one has yet had the skills/balls to chase him down. The only weakness in Machida might be his chin I have yet to see him get rocked in a fight.
Dota Says:
IMO his willingness to engage is near nothing. 75% of the strikes he throws are jabs and low kicks. He needs to start finishing people more decisively. He needs to stop dictating the pace and start pushing it.
Anonymous Says:
oh god the bj band wagon continues
Nnnnn Says:
1. how the fuck is machida slow?
2. chasing someone down implies he's running away from you AKA backpedaling
3. why would you question his chin if he never has been rocked? nonsense
machida rules anyway,
and you're a moron
unodakine808 Says:
i don't understand why machida is getting all of the blame for the "boring" fight. Tito was clearly losing after the first round but didn't do anything to try and take it to machida. When Tito was on the offensive (which only happened a few times in the fight) he was on the losing side of those exchanges, but most of the time he was just trying to avoid machida's kicks. Those double kicks were awesome! I blame Tito for all of those moments of inactivity.
You know the saying "impose his will on his opponent"? That is exactly what machida did the whole fight. A fighter who do that to every opponent he faces should be considered one of the top guys in the LHW division and not boring and especially not starnes-esque...
And for those to knock machida for not finishing fights, the fight could have been called twice, once in the first but Tito was saved by the bell, and after the knee to the body. A very aggressive fighter would get owned by the quicker smarter machida.
. Says:
sherk was done for sure, watch the all the after fight interviews. sherk talks about he has no idea what happened
Joe Rogan Says:
I wanna machida's dick, if u disagree then your a bitch!
Anonymous Says:
machida's a counter fighter if you want better fights grab a more aggresive fight.
more punch's thrown more punches countered
Jemaleddin Says:
Was Carwin piss-tested? Because that guy is HUGE.
Juner671 Says:
Welcome back Wandy! Excellent fight for him and he showed that Jardine doesn't belong in the cage with that level of fighter. There are at least 10-12 guys better than him.
Tito was the reason why some of you thought the fight was "boring". I thought that Machida had a perfect gameplan & executed it well. Tito should have been more aggresive in his takedown attempts especially after losing the 1st round. I'm a Tito fan but what has he done for me lately? Decision over Forrest, Draw with Rashad, & 3 wins over the "World's Most Dangerous, 2 wins in his last 14 fights, Man"? Get some new skills Tito.
BJ Penn is the effing man! Complete destruction of Sherk. The only thing that slighly bothers me is the GSP talk. I don't know if we can handle another loss to GSP. I would like to see BJ defend the LW title many times against the whole gang of guys who are 1, 2, or 3 wins away from a title shot.
PS......... WTF's up with the Carwin dick-riding??? Nice KO for sure but it's a little too soon to be calling out Fedor.
MMA Ratings Says:
I think this was the best fight card I've seen so far this year. Plenty of very relevant fights, one title fight, lots of action in every fight, lots of hype and drama, and good knockouts and submissions. Showing 4 undercard fights (9 fights in all), awesome! Interestingly, I think the runner up for best card this year is UFC 80, which was also headlined by BJ Penn.
I would definitely like to see BJ Penn clean out the lightweight division before he considers moving up, just like I would like to see GSP clean out the welterweights before considering moving up.
I’m pro Machida and I agree with all the pro Machida sentiments out there. There’s nothing wrong with avoiding getting hit as long as you are doing damage yourself, which he obviously always does. I think guys like Machida, are the new breed of MMA fighters, specifically guys that are well rounded AND have such excellent timing that they can inflict damage without taking much. Fighters that can engage wisely, timing their shots, never needing to be reckless, and still capitalizing when an opportunity arises. I think this is what we see with Anderson Silva, Cung Le, and sometimes GSP. We may have seen this with BJ Penn this time as well, but he also had his reach to rely on. I think if you can’t appreciate Machida’s style and skill, maybe you should try pro wrestling.
MOD Says:
LYOTO MACHIDA SUCKS ASS.
THIS GUYS IS WINS THE SAME WAY SHERK DOES BUT HE DOES IT ON HIS FEET.
HE DOESNT TRY TO FINISH FIGHTS, HE TRIES TO WIN A DECISION.
IT PISSES ME OFF THAT HE WILL BE SO HIGH ON THE TOP 10 LHW.
I HOPE WANDI EXPOSES HIS BITCH ASS LIKE HE DID JARDINE.
BJ PENN IS AN ANIMAL. HE BACKS UP HIS SHIT TALKING. PENDING CARDIO HE WILL BEAT GSP. HE DOMINATED THE FUCK OUT GSP ON THE USA VS. CANADA PPV, FOR THE FIRST ROUND, THEN GASED. I LOVE GSP BUT HE WOULD LOSE TO A FOCUSED BJ
HOW BEAUTIFUL WAS THAT ARMBAR TRANSITION IN THE MIDDLEWEIGHT BOUT.
Mondooh 3:17 Says:
Dude!!!
For you non MMA practicing or actual knowledgeable fans of the sport (like a “real” NFL fan analyzes a game) go back to watching the WWF or WFF or what ever the fuck its called if you want every card to be a knockout. Machida is a fuckin awesome and great technical fighter, he is fast (that double kick first right then left he threw at Tito shows his speed over the fright most other fighters would have in having Tito get the takedown), elusive YES indeed the man is smart as fuck he isn’t no retarded Houston Alexander he will not be soo easily knocked out or caught in a ankle lock in the style Cock chest lesnar did. And very fuckin strong DID EVERYONE NOT SEE HIM MAN HANDLING TITOS BIG HEADED TAKEDOWN ATTEMPTS??
I don’t have a man crush (BJ has already taken that spot) or am I a huge fan of Machidas but I respect the sport and give credit where its due, and for you TWAT WAFFLES that can hardly spell less give any insightful or intelligent perspective on the sport or any particular fight do two things
1) Get a word processor idiots
2) Get some fucking schooling in the sport before you let your fucking dick sucker run loose
and go watch the your wrastlin matches
then I guess companies need you dumbasses to buy the PPV, just keep your mouths shut
Mondooh 3:17 Says:
And didcha catch tha liver kick that dropped Tito... DIDCHA???!??!?!! beautiful!!!!
Kablamo Says:
Machida is boring. His style of fighting belongs on the undercard.
Jotorious Says:
Machida is bad-ass. Yeah, this fight was kinda slow paced, but so what? He was fighting Tito. Did you see the end of the first round when Machida was about to KO Tito?
Tyrm1983 Says:
Granted Machida is a great fighter, One of the quickest counter punchers i have ever seen period in boxing or mma. BUT he is boring to watch. He does everything but turn his back and run from the guy he is fighting. It wins him fights which is good for him and if most people were in his position i am sure they wouldn't care if drunk ufc fans called him boring. but to make my point would i pay 40 - 50 bucks for a ufc headlined by a machida fight? probably not, it better have a sweet undercard.
I wasn't even that excited to see this ppv because sherk is horribly boring and does steroids, I am not a fan of Tito and Machida is boring to watch as well. Jardine has 2 impressive wins over Forrest and Chuck but also got KTFO by Houston Alexandar, Wandy hasn't looked like himself in about 4 fights. (was so happy to see him murder jardine though)
But i was sure glad i did watch this ufc, The undercards were all good fights, Watching Wandy win like that actually made everyone in the room with me jump up and yell. The Tito - Machida fight was boring as expected. But watching BJ take Sherk apart really made the night for me. i was really worried about sherk just laying on top of penn for 25 minutes like he did Florian but for some reason sherk tried to stand up with him and that didn't work out to good for him plus that flying knee was brutal.
I think sherk broke his right hand in the 2nd or 3rd round though.
the fan Says:
I believe Sherk attempted a take down at lease twice maybe three times and he didn't even come close to taking down BJ. BJ's take down defense is top notch and Sherk knew he couldn't take the risk of being punished while attempting a take down.
MMA Ratings Says:
I agree that BJ has top notch take down defense, but it won't matter against GSP. GSP will dump BJ on his ass and beat him from side control.
Warcraft Says:
Nnnnn Says:
May 25th, 2008 at 9:52 pm
1. how the fuck is machida slow?
2. chasing someone down implies he’s running away from you AKA backpedaling
3. why would you question his chin if he never has been rocked? nonsense
machida rules anyway,
and you’re a moron"
1. Machida style is slow if you can't see that you are slow yourself. Compared to an axe-murderer like Wandi, Machida fights at a very slow pace.
2. Machida does backpedal/retreat. Its more for countering but he does it.
3. Why wouldn't I question his chin. I've never seen him have to recover in a fight or even if he can after taking a good shot to his head. Unless you think Machida is immune to being knocked out then please STFU.
4. Who was dissing Machida? Sorry you can tell a postive Machida post from a negative one.
The only thing I agree with you on is Machida rules.
Aaron Says:
Was there ever any doubt BJ would dominate? Sherk may have at least had a chance if he enrolled in game plan 101 instead of watching Rocky before the fight.
MMANewbExpert Says:
I think Penn was licking the blood off of Sherk trying to get himself a bit of steroids.