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The Unsupportable Opinion: Clay Guida Won That Fight


(And that’s for asking me how to save money on car insurance! / Pic Props: BRMMA Flickr)

By Jason Moles

Clay Guida won that fight. I know what the scorecards said; Bruce Buffer announced them to the world loud and clear. I know what everybody and their brother said on Twitter as well. None of that matters, though, because I know what I saw. Friday night in Atlantic City, Guida defeated Gray Maynard. In what parallel universe can you throw nearly a hundred more strikes than your opponent, he spends the evening swinging at ghosts, and they declare him the winner? On the mean streets of Albuquerque, New Mexico, if you have all but one of your fourteen takedowns stuffed, that does not make you a winner. That makes…not a winner.

Since when do we penalize fighters for not wanting to get smashed in the face? Guida willingly let himself be locked in a cage with “The Bully” for a total of twenty-five minutes. And yet somehow Maynard still wasn’t satisfied, saying at the post-fight press conference, “You can’t just go to the end of the cage and then back to the other end and back to the other end the whole time. You’ve got to give me a chance, too.”

You’ve got to give me a chance, too?” Sorry, I thought Maynard was a professional fighter. I thought he was above the “If Johnny can’t hit off the pitcher, we’ll just bring out the tee” mentality. First, you don’t like his hair and now you don’t like the way he dances? If I didn’t know any better, I’d think you were looking for a date to the prom. You had your chance and you blew it. Were you really expecting Clay to just stand in front of you like the striking dummies at the gym?

While many thought the actions of “The Carpenter” were egregious enough to warrant a PRIDE yellow card or even a point-deduction, let me point out that I didn’t see “The Bully” give much chase in an attempt to get his hands on Guida and implement his gameplan. It seemed rather, that Maynard was more content to just sit back and complain, flip the bird, cuss at Guida a little — something that in and of itself warranted a point deduction according to the Unified Rules of MMA — and then just sit back some more. Don’t even get me started on Maynard’s repeated hair-pulling. (Another point-deduction right there, if you’re keeping score.)

You see, gentlemen, what we witnessed at UFC on FX 4 was the epitome of Octagon control. In fact, Guida went above and beyond the norm, dominating not only the sponsor sticker in the center, but every square inch of the canvas. Additionally, Guida stuffed thirteen takedowns to keep the fight standing — a prime example of a fighter dictating the pace and location of a fight. Fighters must rely on judges being aware of this, and can only hope the imbeciles sitting cageside are able to recognize it when they see it and score the rounds accordingly. It’s not the first time the wrong fighter had his hand raised, and if life as an MMA fan has taught me anything over the past decade, it won’t be the last.

Clay Guida may not have been willing to become a punching bag for his opponent, nor should he have been. He was also not willing to go balls to the wall trying to take his opponent’s head off or put him to sleep on the mat, with a title shot potentially on the line. In a situation when most out-think the room, the Geico Caveman lookalike followed this popular maxim: Keep It Simple Stupid. Close the distance, get off a few clean shots, and get back out of range so he can’t counter. Simple and effective, no? The last time we saw this gameplan implemented, Carlos Condit won a title belt.

Clay Guida beat Gray Maynard, plain and simple. Guida’s footwork and effective defense kept Maynard guessing at best, punching at phantoms at worst. From bell to bell and post to post, the Greg Jackson product literally danced his way to victory. I know, because I saw it. What fight were you watching?

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buckner23- July 10, 2012 at 6:20 pm
as Billy explained I didnt know that a stay at home mom able to get paid $7613 in a few weeks on the computer. have you read this webpage http://thinfi.com/7py
NomadRip- June 28, 2012 at 10:43 am
Here's the whole fight summarized, for those who don't want to watch the whole 25 minute chase scene:
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http://youtu.be/8FRBQOrvURA
JayJitsu310- June 27, 2012 at 12:55 pm
Maynard dictated the entire fight by being a beast, which is why Guida would not engage him. pitty patting a guy and running around means you are fighting not to lose, and for points. So much for agression. How can anyone think if Guida runs to the other side of the cage and goes "come get me" that he is "dictating" where the fight takes place, especially after he leaves said spot as soon as Maynard comes to him. Maynard dictated where the fight was by chasing Guida from his spot with agression, thereby controlling the octagon. I thought you had to stand your ground to control something? If Guida would have been hurting Maynard, and then retreating, different story, maybe, but he never had him in trouble. Whereas Maynard on the other scored a takedown and a sub attempt. If your plan is to hit someone a little bit at a time, retreat and try to outlast them, and you think that is winning in MMA, you are silly IMO. The UFC used to stand for 2 guys coming in to "Get it on" now it's turning into fighting for points and not getting hurt, pathetic, Jackson Camp needs to take that crap over to boxing, ugh
blackwel- June 27, 2012 at 12:29 am
as Billy explained I didnt know that a stay at home mom able to get paid $7613 in a few weeks on the computer. have you read this webpage NuttyRich.com
Joedirt- June 26, 2012 at 2:55 pm
I agree... but I'm not going to lie to you, as much as Guida won in my mind... it was not the type of fight fans want to see. I started off cheering for Guida and ended hoping the judges would give it to Maynard. But I do think Guida won. He landed more strikes. Moving forward on it's own does not make a winner.
BaghdadBob- June 26, 2012 at 12:22 pm
The "writer" of this post is smoking ass-crack again.
drainplugofideas- June 25, 2012 at 4:59 pm
This is absolutely retarded. Does anyone have the fight metrics on this one? I FUCKING HATED this fight too.
Qlay- June 25, 2012 at 4:26 pm
Nice job generating activity!
I had Guida winning rounds 1,2 and 3, but I was really happy that the judges disagreed with me. Gray won under Pride rules, amirite?
intercept440- June 25, 2012 at 3:56 pm
@cornerman the judges gave it to maynard...therefore the carpenter lost he did not win...the end....
.
@everyone else...move along nothing to see here
slapstix24- June 25, 2012 at 3:24 pm
How do you "outbox" someone by throwing more punches and landing less punches overall?? I don't understand how that equates to outboxing someone. Not only did Gray land a higher percentage of strikes, but he also landed a greater number of strikes throwing almost a hundred less. Some people see what they want to see...
Cornerman- June 25, 2012 at 2:07 pm
The Carpenter won by out boxing, out maneuvering and executing a plan. The Bully got credit for Hair pulling, Complaining and sparse counter-punches. Clay did run once, turned his back and ran. That is what got him a warning but it also seems to have lost him the fight.
yosuplee- June 25, 2012 at 12:24 pm
Who cares who won. Im i the only one that thought it was a shit card and shit main? Bad fight, deserves a bad decision; neither person did enough to win! Instead of a split; it should be a double lose! Ps i still blame jackson/winky.
NukeBlast- June 25, 2012 at 11:42 am
I hate Maynard but some of you must take a look on how fight are judged.

Judges shall evaluate mixed martial arts techniques, such as effective striking, effective grappling, control of the ring/fighting area, effective aggressiveness and defense.

Effective striking...effective like dealing damage I assume. Clearly Maynard as guida wouldn't ko a fly with those powerless punches.

Effective grappling...void because nothing happened. If you think defending a takedown worth something you are on crack.

Control of the ring...200% Maynard. If running backward landing nothing is controlling the ring then I could probably won a UFC championship.

Agressiveness...Maynard again. Guida did not attemped any kind of attack whatsoever.

Defense...if running backward is a kind of defense then that one goes to Guida.
slapstix24- June 25, 2012 at 11:27 am
So you pointed out that Guida threw over a hundred more strikes than Maynard. So obviously you believe in the Leonard Garcia way of fighting, where as long as you're throwing punches, you win the fight. Bc if you'd paid attention to those same stats that indicated Guida threw that many MORE strikes, you would've also noticed that Gray STILL landed more strikes than Guida. I call that "efficient striking." Fighter X throws over a hundred MORE strikes than Fighter Z, yet lands LESS strikes than Fighter Z?? That should tell you right there who won the fight
mcw89138- June 25, 2012 at 10:54 am
Moving backwards and to the sides is not a problem, per se, so long as you can use the movement to launch an effective offensive attack at some point. For example, Mayweather moved in a very similar manner during his fight with Hatton, but he managed to launch a brilliant offensive attack by pivoting on his lead foot and landing a check hook. Sergio Gabriel Martinez and Juan Manuel Marquez also move away from their opponents but are able to launch devastating counter-attacks. Guida's problem is that he never managed to use his evasive maneuvering in an offensive manner. He needs to learn to counter-punch, to throw hooks while pivoting to the side, and to momentarily put his weight down on a punch while moving backwards. Also, Maynard always predictably comes forward at 12 o'clock without head movement, and Guida never seized the opportunity to spring forward and to throw an uppercut where he could predict Maynard's chin would be. A skilled upper-cutter like Carl Froch or Devin Alexander would have put Maynard to sleep in a few minutes. If Guida had taken these offensive measures, his evasive movement wouldn't have cost him the fight.
As Good As Anyone- June 25, 2012 at 10:15 am
Hey cman, skip to 1:05 in this video, and let me know if you want to change your argument. Nice takedown there, right?

http://mmajunkie.com/news/29360/ufc-on-fx-4-video-highlights-with-maynard-guida-swanson-pearson.mma

Your blatant disregard for seeing the takedown attempt stuffed may cloud your ability to see the fight the way it actually happened. Everything you say from here on out is nonsense. Can't argue with video, my friend.
BigWhiskey- June 25, 2012 at 10:09 am
This was one of the more unusual fights I've seen in a long time. I really don't know who won. It seemed Guida landed more punches but that the punches did little damage except for the one kick. Maynard looked more of the agressor because he was walking forward constantly but rarely made contact. However, when he did, he seemed to be throwing the harder punches.

The question in my mind is, will I really look forward to watching either of these guys again after seeing this debacle?

Guida is known for going in there and swinging or doing his lay-and-pray and instead, he looked like Kalib Starnes when he faced Nate Quarry. Has anyone ever seen a UFC fight (including the Quarry/Starnes) in which a fighter was warned for not engaging? If he didn't lose a lot of fans from this match, then I'll be stunned. Maynard was a top contender but seemed slow and unable to lay hands on Guida for a large portion of the time. A top contender shouldn't have issues like this, he should be able to make contact often and take control decisively.

Today's judging makes this difficult when things like 'agression' and 'Octagon control' are used. Guida had some control, but he was moving constantly away from an advancing Maynard, making it difficult to judge.

I honestly don't care who won this one and I hope there isn't a rematch, it was just painful and disappointing to watch and I'm less of a fan of both fighters after this.
intercept440- June 25, 2012 at 9:58 am
your argument is invalid..the judges gave it to maynard....the end
Get Off Me- June 25, 2012 at 9:44 am
Just looking at Guida's career, it is also pretty easy to realize that he did not fight the fight he wanted either. When Guida wins, he uses his wrestling, when he loses, he is outstruck. Guida has learnt how not to get Ko'd, he knows when he must stay out of the pocket and did this well against Gray. A fight is a two way street though and while Guida is avoiding all of this, the other fighter is in a position of moving forward, the only way Guida is able to score in this instance is by outstriking his opponent, simply moving away is not enough, you can't win a fight by being elusive only, there has to be some sting like a bee from that butterfly. Guida wins when he gets opponents on their back, he loses striking matches, this was(albeit unspectacular) a close striking match that Gray won.
Guida moves forward in the 5th, lands more than Gray and he wins, but he didn't plain and simple, if Guida thought he was up 3-1 going into the 5th he was wrong. If after the warning Guida thought he could still win the 5th, he was wrong.If Maynard was warned for stalling in the 5th Guida wins. Guida lost a close one because as a fighter he has learnt how not to get Kenflo'd or Guida'd(like Benson did to him) but he still needs to figure out how to win with this approach he used(G.Jackson style) against Gray. Again Condit executed this style very well against Diaz and was given the nod, because he worked off the back foot while outstriking(check it out Dana Black) Diaz, something Guida was unable to do with Gray, hence why he lost in the end. To say Guida controlled where the fight took place is fine, but to say he had octagon control is a stretch because he was not moving forward rather avoiding forward motion, which means he was reacting to his opponents agression and retreating thus giving octagon control to Gray.
machuko- June 25, 2012 at 9:38 am
Watching the fight I was shocked that Maynard won. Not that I wanted guida to win. there is a fine line of being hard to hit and just running. In fact guida was so much into running around that he didn't even capitalize on Maynard when he stunned him with a head kick. It's boring to watch. He knew he had a chance at the title and just went against everything we thought we knew about guida.
cman- June 25, 2012 at 9:34 am
Fair point get,
I would counter, what did grey do to win the 4th. 3rd ok, 4th? Drop hands and try to for e fight? ( again, gave on balls alone, but did noting else and ended round on his back). 5 rounds, Maynard did little but be frustrated. I can't say "yup rounds xyz, maynard". He just never imposed his will. If they were still fighting Maynard would be suicidally frustrated.
Get Off Me- June 25, 2012 at 10:51 am
Gray won the fourth by walking Guida down, eventually catching him against the cage with about 90 seconds left, going for a submission attempt as the round was ending. Guida escaped the sub attempt, landed a shoulder strike or two and finished in Gray's half guard(but spent all of 10 seconds on top of a 5 minute round). Again Guida cost himself this fight by backing up without landing more strikes than his opponent.
Get Off Me- June 25, 2012 at 9:17 am
@ccman.If Guida wanted to be taken down, outsrtuck and warned for stalling in the 5th round, than Guida controlled the 5th round, sadly those things will lose you a round though. I completely agree with you about Gray not getting the fight he wanted and that Guida controlled how the fight went, but that is also what cost him a warning, not engaging is not control. I had this conversation with some of the guys at Tristar Saturday morning and we kinda all concluded Gray took the fight in the 5th round. Guida fought smart, but definitely not to win, Guida knew if he stayed in the pocket he would be put away, so he stayed outside, which left Gray moving forward towards him which wins fights unless there is a glaring discrepency in striking(which there was not) forward motion>backward motion, no fighter has ever been pulled aside by a referee for moving forward at his opponent. Again 2-2 going into the 5th, what was is it that you saw that Guida did to win the 5th and what Gray did to lose the 5th?
cman- June 25, 2012 at 9:16 am
As good, your high. That was a takedown. Every point you try to make from now on is invalid.
As Good As Anyone- June 25, 2012 at 9:12 am
That wasn't a takedown, Maynard pulled guard with a guillotine - scoring points. Certainly more than the 10 seconds Guida laid on Maynard outside the guillotine.
cman- June 25, 2012 at 8:57 am
@get off me, I disagree. Maynard wanted a specific fight, and couldn't force that fight. Guida controlled how the fight went, Maynard could not impose his will. That is control. The middle was about who didn't have the energy.
I gave Maynard the 4th on badassery on dropping his hands except he took 2 significant strikes and a takedown for it. Fan gave it, rules SHOULDN'T. How often are we told we look with our hearts not eyes? Via unified rules Maynard can not win.
As Good As Anyone- June 25, 2012 at 9:07 am
That wasn't a takedown, Maynard pulled guard with a Guillotine.
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