It is clear what their politics are, so definitely it is clothing that no one should wear. That-said, the swastika is an ancient Hindu religious symbol as well as being a symbol found in numerous cultures (Norse, Near Eastern, and Asian) so it is legitimate for people to wear them as long as the context of is very clear (i.e., no skulls, German helmets, etc.)!

Are you kidding me? I am too cheap to pay damn near $40 on one of those pieces of shit. I'll stick to my cheap ass $20 a piece Tapout shirts. I get enough shit as it is for being German and for having German phrases tattooed on me. lol. I don't need someone thinking I'm the next Hitler now,.

Nate you ask to many questions, and you are dumbass, isn't that enough for you?
You have a different opinion about things than me, and you are often fucking wrong anyways, why make it worse by being one of many instigating asshats? Do you want to continue to toss insults, because you suck at it.


oh and letme....you go buy the fucking shirt, some of us have more class, go have fun being a tool.

Time for me to not be funny for once. I like the overall design of those shirts. Remind me of old school band shirts with very little on them but simple direct lettering and images. Who cares if they are "Nazi" related? Are you afraid that by buying and wearing one of these shirts that your money will somehow help fund a KKK pool party? Give me a break. If you like it, buy it. If not then shut the fuck up. Stop being a nation of shit talkers.

ALL of your responses? I only said 2 things to you, you inbred redneck! And the first one was in response to some dumb shit you said to ME.

And what the hell kind of job do you have where no math, spelling or grammar is needed, but it allows you access to a 'puter? Are you typing to me out of a trailer home while you're living off welfare? You can be honest. You're among friends here.

is trolling all my responses on this website a good thing in YOUR opinion?

^ Sooo, is trolling the comment section like you do all day long a GOOD thing in your opinion?

"richorama Says:
Thu, 12/10/2009 - 08:54

Also, the root of all evil? That would be religion, my friends. Without it, evil people would do evil things. Good people would do good things. The reason why good people do evil things, is because of religion."


ummm noooooooooo that would be MONEY, NOT religion. You need to get your facts straight as well.

good people don't DO evil things...that would be evil people PRETENDING to be good, but it isn't religion that makes someone evil or good, that is a choice we all make as human beings, each person is responsible for his or her choice. And one can change to the other.

as a counterpoint to my point about the saying being "money is the root of all evil", I really don't believe that saying. I believe the root of all evil is man. Man or HUMAN because they are the only animal on this planet with a soul, and a higher power of brain function is allowed the previous said GOD given choice to choose to be evil or good, THAT is the root, it comes from our flawed, and fallible human makeup.

White Powwa!

@ mt59801:

If you feel so strongly about ur opinion, then i challenge you to walk around Compton, Harlem or Atlanta wearing one of the HR shirts.

Also, the root of all evil? That would be religion, my friends. Without it, evil people would do evil things. Good people would do good things. The reason why good people do evil things, is because of religion.

@UFC fan

Hubris: Overbearing pride or presumption; arrogance.

Dude, take it down a little. I dont want to be presumptuous but you really need to get laid.

mt59801 you seriously need to actually study history before you can pull untrue bullshit factoids out your ass. Nobody BUT the Nazi's every attempted to kill off all of ONE race. No other country or waring faction has ever pulled that , just Hitler and his Nazi regime. you need to learn the difference between a waring country that wars to expand its global significance and one that wars for money as apposed to what Hitler did. You are ignorant of the facts. and nothing on this planet signifies evil fucking humans like the Nazi symbols. Time doesn't diminish it. Hitler wasn't trying to get more land or money for Germany he was trying to eradicate Jews, that is a whole new level never before seen, and never will be again I hope.
Join the military and learn the truth and get educated young man, you need to know better, and serve your country while doing it.

831 Son you call everyone 'fags' because that's the only insult you've learned after 5 years in school and 30 years of wasted life. Sure you went to school and have a job cleaning shitters in comuunity pools, but that only means you are a fucking loser. Your only friend and girlfriend is your right hand. I don't wanna say you should die because you are dead already on the inside. All you do is call everybody faggots on the internet like a worthless keyboard warrior. I don't wanna talk about ur parents. They didn't give a fuck before, they dont give a fuck now. Fuck em.

look Nate I'm just pointing out that every culture/nation has some horrific act of war or genocide in their past, but for some reason we've been conditioned to identify the nazi regime with absolute evil. I'm an american, and when I look at our history there's just as much genocide and bullshit, same thing for the UK. Look at the actions of israel now towards palestine. To me it's like saying ban Warrior wear because of the helmet logo, it reminds me that the 1208-1249 Albigensian Crusade killed over a million frenchmen suspected of being Albigensians. The only thing that makes this any less ridiculous is the passage of time. If you really feel that strongly about some shirts then sponsor those fighters yourself so they don't have to rely on the "dirty shirt money" to eat and feed their families. /rant

^^^ Moron.

Why all the german hating? I'm japanese/german/irish. It's cool if I wear a japanese flag or black dragon, no says anything negative about shamrocks, but if I sport an Iron Cross or german eagle everyone is like "Dude you're a minority why are you wearing that racist shit". Maybe they should also ban anything with a star of david, star and crescent, hammer and sickle,a union jack, a crucifix or any of the other 1000 or so symbols that have been used various military organizations throughout history

You think because I call you a homo (Very true) that I call everyone that? Wow loser, get over yourself. You obviously don't know what you are talking about and continue to be a worthless troll of this site. I bet you have absolutely no friends, don't have a job, dont go to school, and so on.... To sum it up, you are a worthless piece of shit. I bet your parents would be happy if you just died already. We would be too, pussy.

wow UFC fag, you said it yourself.
So, according to you, "831 son tears me a new asshole". That's unexpected because all he does is call everybody including me homosexual. That's really original... in your book at least. I just feel the new asshole appearing next to the old one. O boy, I better get it checked out.
I know you secretly admire me because I'm the greatest poster on this site and my first comments are amazing. It's so evident you don't have to pretend that you want me dead.

@ baldwinsteeth
I know, eh? It's like he is bipolar or something. First he says how ppl troll on this site and then..."You are a fucking piece of shit trash". O'rly?

"evil is evil, regardless of how it was branded. religion, on the other hand, is truly an insult to human dignity. but that's neither here nor there. isnt this an MMA website?"

You are a fucking piece of shit trash, just so you know where we stand.

@robthom

i wouldnt say that it's "infinetely" more acceptable to discuss punching Christ in the face, although that is infinetely more humorous. i was checking out some of your posts in a really half-assed manner and, if i read correctly which i most certainly did not, i see where you're coming from. it does seem, at times, that what happened to european jews 70 years ago is treated as the single biggest crime ever perpetrated. of course, this is debatable. good on you for saying what isnt easy. evil is evil, regardless of how it was branded. religion, on the other hand, is truly an insult to human dignity. but that's neither here nor there. isnt this an MMA website?

Makes me think of the debate of whites being allowed to use the "N" word since it's excessively used by those that the word offends: blacks.

Bottomline is that some things are just never going to be ok.

If they're not Nazis, why don't they sponsor any Jewish fighters?

Without jumping in the cluster-fuck that is this age old debate, and interjecting my own personal views on this issue like everyone else, as though anybody in the world cares about what a doucebag that calls himself "Robthom" or "SnallTrippin" thinks about Nazis or the Holocaust, I just want to know...

Where do I get one of those shirts?

By now, I think everyone knows the best way to stir controversy and spark interest in something is to ban it. Especially something like this. That way, two "journalists" who run a website and have very obviously biased views against this sort of thing, can fail miserably at an objective report of this news, but succeed with flying colors at bringing worldwide media attention to some obscure and desperate t-shirt company.

I may have slept through History class but didn't the Nazi's hate the Jews? Why is it a big deal that they sponsor no black fighters when their big problem was with other "whites"?

Still a cool looking shirt but not for me. Agree with Robthom, you wear it, you deal with the consequences.

@ UFC fan

You just made me LOL. Awesome effort.

"KillDozer Says:
Wed, 12/09/2009 - 01:05

UFC fag, you are just butt hurt you aint first stupid bitch. I don't really need to insult you since it's been done in every single topic with your comments. Every time someone says: "UFC fag is a dumb racist troll, a 40-year old virgin with no life... bla bla bla" This shit is geeting old. I'll continue to "bring nothing to the table on this site" and just avoid internet-tough-guy-contest with you since it's not worth my time. Shit, i won't even say how I fucked your mother since she is probably dead. At least she is not around to see her pathetic keyboard warrior of a son wasting his life on a MMA blog. I'll just stand aside and watch you and 831 son throw shit at each other like you normally do. It'll make me look smarter than any of you "significant contributors". Yeh, that's right, go fuck yourself."

oh killdumbass don't tease us or me, you cannot avoid us internet tough guys, and you can't stay back and watch you are the polyp on the colon of this site you have to dangle there and be a pain there is no way you can shut up. garbage like you can never shut up till someone puts a bullet in your skull.
You just keep on being first, you and curtis samples can play the gay first game all you want, and I hope by doing so you will finally get the attention that COOL and cockLOCK Hal got. You say the same shit to me that you say to 831 son, and you fail when he tears you a new ass, and you fail everytime you post, keep right on failing, and we will keep pointing it out to you.

Cmon guys, do you really think someone will read a 5+ line reply?
Don't waste your time trying to explain why the orange is round.

But Nazis are Nazis and this shitty clothing company is indeed Nazi. whoever supports it should be buttfucked.

I also see the swastika

I say if you want to base your clothing off Nazi Germany, do that shit. But don't pussy-foot around it, cowards. You wanna wear a shirt with SS bolts on it, it should say 'I love Hitler's balls in my face' on the back. Be a man. You wanna rep Nazism take the ass-whoopings that come with it. Call it MMA training. I'm going to come out with a line of clothing based on the bubonic plague pandemic and call it 'Black Def'

It's all about PR people, and keep in mind my other posts in this thread, because to be fair Stalin killed a hell of a lot more of his own people than Hitler, but Hitler was the enemy while Stalin was a nominal ally for a while at least. *shrug* Tons of evil people, Nazis just one of the few that have survived generations to be hated. S'life.

UFC fag, you are just butt hurt you aint first stupid bitch. I don't really need to insult you since it's been done in every single topic with your comments. Every time someone says: "UFC fag is a dumb racist troll, a 40-year old virgin with no life... bla bla bla" This shit is geeting old. I'll continue to "bring nothing to the table on this site" and just avoid internet-tough-guy-contest with you since it's not worth my time. Shit, i won't even say how I fucked your mother since she is probably dead. At least she is not around to see her pathetic keyboard warrior of a son wasting his life on a MMA blog. I'll just stand aside and watch you and 831 son throw shit at each other like you normally do. It'll make me look smarter than any of you "significant contributors". Yeh, that's right, go fuck yourself.

Am I the only one who sees a VERY thinly disguised swastika in the HR next to the skull?

Plenty of Muslims condemn the actions of the "Holy Warriors" that kill "infidels" for their quest to get some sweet virgin action. You make it sound like this is what most Muslims choose to believe. You must be declaring Holy Ignorance. Anyway, what do Muslims have to do with the Nazi influenced (obviously) shirt?

Are you a skin? If not, why are you so upset with this?

Good to see that the freedom democracy provides is alive and well. You want freedom? Let's see you acknowledge a man whose words make your blood boil, who's standing center stage and advocating at the top of his lungs that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the top of yours.

I can see why Nazis get a bad rap, as they were...... 70 years ago........ perpetrators of one of the single most effective attempted genocides ever. My only question is: Why doesn't the whole Muslim religion get the same treatment? Their whole "holy book" preaches about how much inferior everyone who doesn't believe the same as they do are. It tells you do go give your life killing as many infidels as possible in order to go to heaven and get 72 virgins. Muslims (not all i'm sure, but I don't hear Muslims condeming what their brethren do every day) want to clean the entire planet of people they view as different, and are actively working on it (how many people killed in bombings this week alone? 500+?).

Nazis are viewed as ignorant, hateful people. No one takes them seriously, except to do all they can to supress their views. So why do we make special concessions to a group with similar motives and a larger overall body count? Why do people balk at countries that take measures to prevent themselves from being overun by this religious dogma (Switzerland) while a neighboring country hosts rioting by the Muslims trying to force their beliefs and laws on others (France)?

I don't care if some idiot wants to be sponsored by a clothing co. that may or may not be Nazi related. I don't care if a fighter wears clothes that were developed by a co. that makes gangsta clothes for gangbangers, perpetuating the ignorance of racial stereotypes. Most fighters don't get enough exposure to be able to demand good "show" money, and MMA sponsorship is still in it's fledgling phase, so it's probably more of a "take what you can get" type of situation. It isn't like fighters have Snickers, Gatorade, Go Daddy, Google, or any of the top 10 spoting goods companies. The UFC only recently (within the last 2-3 years) started to get big sponsorship from themselves, with BK getting the TuF floor, and Bud Light (lol) getting the PPV floor. I'd be willing to bet they pay inordinate amounts of money to the UFC for that distict privledge, which may turn off sponsors who are researching potential advertising avenues and find that advertising by MMA may just be too pricey what companies want to invest in the highly limited exposure. And then there's the whole alleged UFC wanting a cut of sponsorship money from fighters to allow the sponsor. Who knows how that turned out after it was supposed to have began at and after UFC 100? And then there is the whole "piss off the UFC in any number of ways and get banned from being a sponsor" bit.

I dunno, it;s not always the ideal situation, but sometimes maybe peopel should just MIND YOUR OWN FUCKING BUSINESS AND LET PEOPLE BE! WHO ARE YOU, THEIR FUCKING DAD?


/end rant

It is blatant nazi bullshit. But that's how it is, crazy is, as crazy does.
denial doesn't change facts, glad the ZUFFA team finally caught it.
I am with you Johnny taa, who cares if they sponsor black guys, I wanna see em sponsor a jew THEN we will see if they are non nazi or not.

I hate to do this, it goes against my better judgment, and I should sit back and watch scum attack scum, BUT:
Killdozer you are one among many on here who actually makes 831 son look sane, you are so utterly fucking stupid and say the most goofy off the wall shit that even 831 son has to call you down from your crazy peak. You and your goddamn gay ass FIRST shit is right up there with COOL! and HAL. You bring nothing to this site not even a good fight, you are a waste of sperm, and I think that cunt of a mother of yours almost swallowed you and you ran down her crusty flesh into that crevice from the 3rd layer of hell she calls her twat and you sprang forth like a window licking spawn from hell.
I don't care who I have to sacrifice but I want you back in your pit soon as possible.

Dont give a damn about their black fighter, lets see if theyll sponser brendan shaub....

No prob.


You had me tripping for a minute and I had to go back and reread myself to see if I somehow mangled my words to imply that?!


I would never say something like that.
I'm not that crazy.

No I was being serious. But I just went back and read it. I read it too fast the first time. My bad

@ rampageisgod.


Are you trying to be funny?

What's sad is that it took Zuffa this long, they even made a point to show Joe Brammer's walk out to the cage, yet they didn't show any of the later walk outs?

Hate to say it but this is exactly what Bob Arum is talking about and this is why Zuffa wont allow it.

The ben's could have at least posted the shirt that HR had that was a direct rip-off of an Aryan wear shirt.


Some of those shirts literally have SS uniforms on them, but in stead of the SS insignia, they replace it with HR

i tried to post a link to some good stuff where HR tries to defend there position but it seems its being blocked so whateves

I hate Illinois nazis.

Good riddance douchebag nazis.

Robthom are you saying the descendants are being hyper-sensitve or the people who actually fled?

Wow! I'm surprised that all you "gay skinhead" MMA fans aren't more upset by this ban! ;-)

If they can ban Clinch Gear because Hendo wasn't moving fast enough for their liking and ban RCVA for sponsoring Fedor in another organization, I am curious why these morons got air time on Spike TV last Saturday night.

I mean, is some dude walking out in this kind of shit really the image the UFC wants to project to the average person who is unfamiliar with the sport?

BTW, I do have Jewish friends who's family came here fleeing nazi Germany who get freaked out by stuff like those shirts.

I kind of feel that they're being hyper-sensitive and should get over it. But I also feel hurt to see the pain on their face, so I do understand that its just not acceptable in mixed company.

Those shirts look pretty bad ass to me. I bought one a few weeks back and since then everytime someone greets me I just shoot my arm into the air and scream Sieg Heil! It's weird

And Dana White folds like a lawn chair... pathetic. As a history buff, I appreciate Prussian/Teutonic military power and the imagery that represents it. It's unfortunate that Hitler felt the same way and modeled much Nazi symbolism on the Prussians, but that shouldn't ruin it forever. As long as a fighter's clothes are free from profanity and explicit images, they should be allowed to wear whatever they want.

@itsgalf
i'm trolling ur mom right now, doggy style

@Richard Fitzentite
pardon me for rounding up the number to 70. I'm glad guys like you take time to calculate the real number and point out my mistake. Say, you and 831 son should hook up since you both love Twilight and pink unicorns.

@ snall, I agree that its not a good idea for UFC to embrace this particular product. See the last paragraph of my first post farther up.

As far as anti-Anyfuckingpeoplefornofuckingreason, I agree that to do that undermines anybody who would describe themselves as "good" or even civilized. But I think that "fornofuckingreason" is the operative piece of word there.

I understand becoming anti-something if you've decided that you have a good reason. Its a judgment call IMO, hopefully using good judgment. There's some things that I've decided that I just dont want in my world. And I think I have a right to that as long as I'm not going out of my way to hurt someone who hasn't hurt me, and as long as I'm not forcing my opinion on others.

I'm not trying to lessen how "evil" what the nazi's did was, I just think that its interesting that that particular type of evil is almost always just associated with nazis.

I'm no history buff, but I'm pretty sure that the nazi's weren't the only people/nation to start an ethnic or religious war and horrifically slaughter their enemies in said war.

Again I'm not saying its right or acceptable, just that they weren't the only ones.

And as far as the definition of "antisemitism", I dont want to debate who or what makes one Jewish. I dont know a lot about it so your definition is fine with me.

It's a pretty strait lookin shirt.

Iron Crosses own

"They also only sponsor white fighters (edit: they do appear to have one black guy on the payroll)"

Genius didn't think to check the website before writing an article?

Rob, you can speak about Germans in WW2 with open minded people fine (Although NAZIS can be different...depending). But a BUSINESS that relies on media...has to watch out for shit like that.

....also...how is anti-Anyfuckingpeoplefornofuckingreason not evil? Also antisemitism would be anti-a language.

@ jinzer, I agree.
Reverse intolerance is still intolerance IMO.
(Although I do believe in the death penalty and generally reaping what you sow, just not proactively.)

@ Richorama, I always thought it was interesting that its infinitely more acceptable to punch Jesus than it is to describe anything even obscurely related to Nazis or anti-semitism as anything less than the purest of evil.

Yes...but an iron cross, with a WW1 German helmet and word 'Reich'..not good. And I personally love Nazi uniforms and such...and HATE Nazis...it's a bitch it is...(German/Irish raised by a Jew..lol).

"When Joe Brammer walked out... ... at UFC 107?
we are still a few days out from 107 Bens.

so i guess now isnt the best time for my dream of Christ Puncherz Clothing to take flight

I wouldn't wear the shirt anyway but there is alot of ignorance in the main post. The iron cross isn't a nazi symbol in fact they are still the emblem of the German military today. Iron crosses are still given out to soldiers in the German military for outstanding service much like the purple heart in the US military. There is no need to battle ignorance with more ignorance. Just because something is German doesn't mean it is Nazi. That line of thinking shows alot of ignorance and is very offensive. The clothing line also supports at least one african american fighter. I don't support the clothing company but please just get your facts straight instead of trying to sensationalize a report.

Aw how sad, KillDozer is being a little girl and crying again. When will she die.. It would do everyone a favor.

I'm going to buy that shirt and then proposition Bob Arum in the mens room.

I'm no Nazi or skinhead, but I dont have a problem with the actual shirts personally. Dont like it, dont wear it. If you wear it, accept the possible consequences.
Etc, etc.

I believe in the freedom to wear that shirt as long as you accept the responsibility for it.

Probably not the smartest imagery to promote in UFC's shoes though. There's a time and a place to be insensitive and honest, primetime/popular television aint it.

what's really funny is that KillDozer is actually one of the Bens, trolling all of us normal posters

I just looked at the comparison article on Middle Easy and this really couldn't be more obvious. Every bit of their clothing design reeks of White Power. Their imagery in some cases directly copies Nazi and Neo-Nazi imagery (which is hilariously lazy), they send their clothing to neo-nazi bands, and they use phrases like "100%er" that mean one thing and one thing only.

We mma fans already have to deal with other people thinking we're bloodthirsty ingrates. We don't need this to help stoke that stereotype. And btw, saying you're not a racist but really into "WWII German imagery" is kind of like saying you're not a pedophile but really fascinated with pics of naked children.

Like another poster said, if it walks like a goose then it is a goose. I haven't seen something this blatant since Tito stepped in a pile of Jenna.

Fight Linker said they are sponsoring a black guy, didn't catch his name. I'm mixed black and white and personally I think the old style is kind of cool.

I wouldn't be caught dead wearing that shit because of what it stands for, but looks wise, neato.

In happen to be from germany guys and the stuff on the shirts I've seen so far is *not* banned over here. What gets you into trouble in germany is sporting a swastika, SS runes or similar shit in a public space. The iron cross however is still a sign used in medals of our army and not specifically associated with the nazi-era (although it is true we're all very sensible when it comes to any images from the days of the third reich and some people will at least be irritated if you walk around with Hoelzer-Reich-like imagery. I certainly wouldn't if only to not be associated with the wrong crowd).

Actually in computer games like "Call of Duty", the swastikas are often replaced by iron crosses in the german version of the game to ensure it doesn't get banned.

The only remotely cogent point Holzer makes in defense of using Nazi imagery is that the Iron Cross is widely used by modern "counter-culture" individuals and companies, for instance Jesse James' West Coast Choppers. That said, it should be noted that Mac Danzig and Ross Pearson, whom Holzer previously sponsored, publicly told Holzer to fuck off.

German laws about Nazi imagery are justifiable in light of their country's history. Free speech isn't absolute in any country.

@ Dozer, WWII ended in 1945...just a little FYI.

@ KJGould

"I've read German MMA fans say you would flat out be arrested in Germany for wearing those shirts."

You would be. So much for "democratic" Germany.

For the record, the Iron Cross was awarded to German soldiers decades before World War II.

What's wrong with bein Nasty?

831 son, you are the only loser on this site that calls everyone fags. You sure know a lot about faggotry. Are you looking for a partner or something? you should seek butt sex friends somewhere else.

Lose the spike on the helmet R&D.
The top and bottom rockers are a cool notion.

i feel bad for Germans now. they have been brainwashed for 70 years after WWII. Now it's illigal even to think about nazis.

To say they aren't affiliated in some form is unthinkable. If it steps
like a goose, it is a goose.

As well, it is sad they can't man up and stand up for their cause and take the consequences, even though it is dubious..

I'd buy that for a dollar.

That company is run by tools.

Justin Driggers.....sponsored fighter......black.......? Even that won't save these wierdos. Pretty much looks like every bit of nazi propaganda that they could fit onto a shirt.

Fucking homo^. Once again you prove you are a retarded troll. Good job loser.

and btw, FIRST. 831 son, go ride donkey cock you little twat

Yeah, I'd say they were being provocative and controversial in order to make money at the least, if not push a sinister agenda. I've read German MMA fans say you would flat out be arrested in Germany for wearing those shirts.

bullshit, it aint nazi at all